Hybrids versus Electric Cars
GM is on the hybrid bandwagon while other automakers continue to argue against it.
Kevin Bullis 10/25/2007
- 38 Comments
According to the Wall Street Journal, Honda, Nissan, and Renault are making the same arguments against hybrid vehicles that General Motors made several years ago to predict that hybrids would fail. (See "Hybrid or Electric: Car Makers Take Sides" and "Honda Won't Pursue Plug-in Hybrids.") The difference now is that the arguments are right this time--at least for some markets.
In the 1990s, U.S. automakers such as GM led the development of hybrid-vehicle technology. But GM elected to drop hybrids in favor of a much longer-term technology--hydrogen fuel-cell vehicles--arguing that hybrids were too expensive and didn't provide enough environmental benefit to be successful. Then Toyota's Prius proved GM wrong. And recently, GM has become a big promoter of hybrid technology, especially next-generation plug-in hybrids.
Not so Honda, Nissan, and Renault. According to the Journal report, Carlos Ghosn, the CEO of Renault and Nissan, complains that hybrids don't really do much to reduce petroleum consumption and pollution, arguing that it's better to build all-electric vehicles that have zero emissions. U.S. automakers such as GM made the same arguments, although they pushed for fuel-cell vehicles, not battery-powered vehicles. (GM, of course, already had a battery-electric vehicle, the EV1, which it scrapped.)
Honda currently sells hybrid vehicles, but the company's president and CEO, Takeo Fukui, is skeptical of next-generation plug-in hybrids. Such cars would still have both electric motors and a gasoline engine, but they could go much farther on electricity alone than today's hybrids can. GM has been touting its Volt concept, which would go 40 miles on electricity stored in lithium-ion batteries. For longer trips, a gas generator would kick on to recharge the battery, providing an additional 600 miles of range. Fukui's argument is that the gas engine in the Volt is unnecessary. Presumably, he is suggesting that it would be better, and cheaper, to use batteries alone, or to stick with gasoline.
His argument doesn't make sense in the United States, where there's probably not much of a market for a car that can only go 40 miles on a charge. But a couple of trends suggest that there may indeed be a growing market for relatively short-range electric cars. London has a congestion tax on vehicles driving in the city--and other cities are considering imposing similar fees--from which zero-emission vehicles are exempt. It's not unlikely that such regulations could evolve to keep non-zero-emission vehicles out of city centers entirely, Ghosn suggests. Meanwhile, the taxes make it more expensive to drive gas-powered cars. Climate-change legislation could also make it more expensive to drive conventional vehicles. As these costs rise, the people who will feel the pressure most are those who are likely unable to afford a car with both an engine and an electric motor. For them, a 40-mile, zero-emission, all-electric commuter could be appealing, especially considering the fact that (in the United States) most people drive less than 40 miles a day.
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geisemann
2 Comments
GM is not making a HYBRID
F
Hybrid=A combo Technology something MID TERM
Full Electric= Future.
The EV1 is all-electric and GM Volt being made is all electric.
Stop calling the VOLT A HYBRID
As an Electrical engineer I know the difference between Hybrid and Electric.
Stop calling the GM volt a HYBRID. Hybrid in terms of technology is low tech.
It takes me back to the times of TUBE - Transistor TV sets when Transistor technology was not up to snuff and people had to use tubes.
Called a 1960 Hybrid TV set.
All electric is MUCH superior in terms of maintance, no oil changes, no Nickel battery waste etc.
GM for the record is making an Electric car with an engine to charge the battery if needed. The charge engine can be removed and the car will still work. A hybrid cannot do this it uses an old tech gas engine with help from an electric engine.
Reply
malkmus
3 Comments
Re: GM is not making a HYBRID
Absolutely right, the Volt is by concept an electric car with a (albeit large) on board generator.
In an interesting aside the weight of a car becomes much less of an issue in electric cars since most of the energy penalty for accelerating a heavy vehicle is recovered during the breaking, hence the penalty in efficiency for having an on board generator is not all that large.
The only slight worry I see with the Volt is that it is currently specified with LiIon based batteries. There is at the moment no known Li battery that has a sufficient number of recharge cycles for automotive use. Equally there is no in the field experience with automotive LiIon whatsoever. Hence behaviour in harsh environmental conditions over a long period of time has not been tested yet. It seems to me that a realistic time frame for the Volt (or any other mass market Li based electric car) will have to be somewhat further in the future. Maybe if the cycle from Prototype to mass market for most automotive technologies is anything to go by 2012-2015 should be a more reasonable if slightly depressing estimate. Lets hope some major breakthrough in batteries happens soon....
Reply
franquellim
14 Comments
Re: GM is not making a HYBRID
I have to disagree with your assertions about Lithium Ion batteries. While I am not a scientist, I have read reports about at least two companies, A123 Systems and Compact Power, Inc, which have produced cells which have will be used in demonstration packs due to GM at the end of this month.
GM expects to begin road testing "mules" (likely malibu frames with EV drivetrains and batteries) by the end of this year. They have announced a manufacturing facility and already have supplies for all major components, including battery packs, with a production target of 2010.
Please refer to the excellent website "www.gm-volt.com" for additional information.
(I'm not affiliated with the site, just a fan)
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Guest (jpdemers)
Re: GM is not making a HYBRID
I believe that today's batteries do have the necessary lifetimes -- the problem right now is the cost (hence the notion of leasing the batteries, to keep the sticker price from being so high that it's dismissed out of hand by consumers.)
Americans don't use their cars just to commute, which I think needs to be taken into account. They take long trips, and take a ton of toys with them, on vacations and weekends. Most can't afford two cars, which leads to all those single-passenger SUVs making the daily commute to the office at 13 miles per gallon.
A plug-in electric with an on-board generator, and a 600-mile range, is what these people will be wanting.
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guetenburg
6 Comments
Re: GM is not making a HYBRID
The GM Volt (If it's made) is a Hybrid. It's a SERIES HYBRID. Thus, there is electric generation in series with the electric motor. One feeds the other. The gasoline / Battery-Electric Motor hybrids are called parallel hybrids.
For an ELECTRIC CAR, go to www.Plug-InMotors.com. This company is making Pure Electric Plug-In Vehicles. Or EV's.
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RichardL
3 Comments
Re: GM is not making a HYBRID
Actually, it is a hybrid. Just a different type. What Toyota makes is called a parallel hybrid because the engine and batter pack worth in parallel to provide power. The Volt will be a series hybrid, meaning the engine's only reason for existance is to power the battery.
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hamid
11 Comments
Re: GM is not making a HYBRID
Agree, it is conceptually incorrect to call a serial hybrid (as opposed to a Prius parallel hybrid) a hybrid.
This is an EV with range extension. So it can be called a
REEV: Range extended electric vehicle
or an
EREV
The new nano-phosphate lithium ion batteries have a lifetime of 15 years (5000 recharge cycles), do not catch fire, do not heat, work in -20 temperature, and can deliver so much power that an EV can easily beat a Ferrari.
Checkout A123. There are no serious questions remaining about the battery, except for cost.
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